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The first midwife seemed to understand what we were trying to say, and said she would ask the doctor to come and talk to us. And, for a few hours, I'm convinced I've made a terrible mistake. The following is a quote from their report: If the scan reveals either a suspected or confirmed abnormality, the woman should be informed by the sonographer at the time of the scan. By this time, we were tired. Specialist scans had a powerful effect on some parents because they could see the baby more clearly and in some cases people recognised which parts of the baby's body were not working properly. We'd sort of put those discussions to the back of our mind, and then all of a sudden there are other abnormalities so yeah it was a bit a bit of a shocker [laughs]. We scattered his ashes over a bunch of snowdrops. I loved him instantly and didn't want to let him go. x. Rather sharply, my partner tried to explain. No, we really didn't, with hindsight we probably should have, but not at all, it never occurred to us to be worried about it. 12/12/2012 22:41. I couldn't work out what was taking so long and put it down to the doctor being young and inexperienced. It is extremely rare for these pregnancies to reach term as they typically spontaneously miscarry early in pregnancy. We had the baby cremated. Some hospitals do offer earlier anomaly scans of the baby, but they will not show as much detail as scans performed between 18 and 20weeks. In order for the sonographer to get good images of your baby, the scan is carried out in a dimly lit room. I know its hard- but i really wouldnt worry about it too much as the worry will stress you and your body out. 'Yes, if that's okay with you,' kind of thing, like you do. Scans cannot find all conditions. And my partner and I would have a completely different life from the one we'd imagined. I didn't have a clue. I was another one who did get bad news at the 20 week scan. My baby might have Down's syndrome. But other than that everything was fine. On January 18, my baby was born, at 23 weeks - a little boy. By the time I left the hospital, I was in shock. We couldn't say we'd lost the baby, because he was still kicking away, but we couldn't pretend everything was fine, either. I was told they needed to do a blood test to get a bench mark of my hormone levels. I did think it was a bit strange that she wasn't talking, and then she sort of said, 'Oh, I think there's a problem. Though the 18-20 week scan can detect when certain parts of the baby's body have grown abnormally, it may not be possible for clinicians to identify why it has happened or make a firm diagnosis based on the scan alone. So instead, I was advised to go home and let nature take its course. I broke down and started hitting my disgusting body that had done this. As you felt that, you know, it was probably going to show lots of problems and it just wasn't what we wanted, but at the same time we needed to sort of see it and, we needed to prove it I suppose. I pray it's just her heart but I can't see anything else is wrong as I have been scanned by a consultant since I was 14 weeks and every time he has said everything looks okay and she is growing consistently. It seemed inconceivable that we would not be having a baby in May. We understand the real meaning of "shit happens". I was booked back in to discuss management options, if nothing had happened. We also use cookies set by other sites to help us deliver content from their services. blood tests, CVS) were clear - and as one woman put it, 'after the triple test* (Down's syndrome screening) you stop thinking anything can go wrong'. Others said they were shocked because all the early diagnostic tests (e.g. Thanks girls, it's amazing how protected our babies are in there isn't it?! Mm-hm. I had never imagined having an amniocentesis. With my oldest it turns out she has a minor thing that affects 1 in 1000 of the population and wont harm her at all it's just "there" and with my second the issue turned out to be nothing. Sometimes doctors will wait to give the baby more time to develop and carry out repeat scans - this had confused several parents we talked to who had gone for repeat scans not knowing that the baby might have a problem. Good luck has not come easily over the past few years. And I am slowly coming to terms with what has happened. To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account. You will then be asked to raise your top to your chest and lower your skirt or trousers to your hips. I would be put to sleep, and when I woke up I wouldn't be pregnant any more. Wed like to set additional cookies to understand how you use GOV.UK, remember your settings and improve government services. I didn't want to go through anymore scans. We didn't feel we could tell anyone what was happening. The baby was kicking so hard that I began to believe him. As I was called for my scan I was nervous and emotional. Most scans are carried out by specially trained staff called sonographers. So carried on with the plans, and, you know, planning for the, another baby to come along and then we went for a 20- week scan which is obviously the big one and very exciting, seeing all the arms and legs and once again everything was going fine, 'Look here's the baby, here's the length of baby'. Immediately I knew what decision we should take. We thought it would all be over very quickly but, in fact, it was another 11 hours before the baby was delivered. I mean the lady who was scanning was very quiet for a long time. Not a good sign in a hospital consulting room. And nothing prepares you at all. So it was, there was very, very little movement from the baby because I remembered first time round by that stage, you know, that the baby was quite big and it moved around a lot at a later scan. What were babys measurements at 20 week scan? Next most likely (but actually in the minority) they identify something which whilst not 100% healthy is treatable. It was exactly like the labour I had with my first child. The pain was excruciating, but nothing compared to how I felt inside. We were bound to each other because of the blood that was on both our hands. So and you could see the exomphalus, this little pouch, which was obviously just the intestines where they are. When I think about how long it took them to deliberate ultimately, maybe not, but it just felt like a bit of a fast food situation, didn't it? For women who have been given distressing news about their baby during the scan, there should be a health professional available to provide immediate support. It felt as if we'd gone underground, that we were part of the criminal fraternity. I was told this was common as my body and hormones still thought I was pregnant. Why me and not you, you bastard? [Husband] couldn't make it. Reading individual, real-life experiences can be a helpful resource, but it is never a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment from a qualified health care provider. She wanted to have a look at the skull, which was the main thing, but she couldn't see it from where the baby was. I think it's the same - in fact I think it was probably the same room, same consultant - and [sighs] I suppose it felt upsetting because at the dating scan you're full of hope and this scan we knew wasn't going to be good, we knew it was maybe the last time we would see the baby moving around. The 18 -20 week fetal anomaly scan is a watershed in most pregnancies because for the majority of women it will be the last time they are scanned before giving birth. And they took me into another room. The thing that I have a very strong memory of is this child's face in amazing detail. There, I would give birth. After she had taken all the measurements, the sonographer told us that she was concerned with the length of the baby's limbs in relation to the head. I couldn't have the added responsibility for changing his mind. But my brain had been given a train of thought that was impossible to stop. Public Health England (PHE) created this information on behalf of the NHS. I still feel guilty, I still cry at random times. All my instincts were to protect my belly, yet here I was allowing someone to stick a huge needle into it. It felt like a lifetime to reach our 12-week-scan. You've had your, you know, you've had your triple test and everything was fine. I let out an animal scream and [wife] kind of leapt onto me on the bed. Hugely upset that to think that the baby was so poorly. And that was a terrible moment to be sort of hanging on, waiting. And that was scanning up from the above the head, then you were coming up through the child's head, so you were seeing the chambers in the brain, sort of it was evident in all four chambers of the brain, then suddenly one chamber was empty. Fine, go on my own. I was then told yet again bad news. Emma was 20 weeks' pregnant when a routine scan revealed that the baby she was expecting had Down's syndrome and heart problems. My partner tried to remain calm, and at my request rang my mum. It was interesting - well it was fantastic to see this fetus and to see this child that was yours that was horribly ill - but you didn't really get much opportunity to see that because the consultant was more about measurements and all sorts of blood flow and various other screens coming up. There is more detailed information about the main conditions that are looked for during this scan on NHS.UK. But here I was, minutes later, lying down, waiting. Nice people shouldn't hear about what we'd done. And it turned out the baby's heart wasn't forming properly, the chambers weren't forming properly. Maybe. And it was then because we were at 20 weeks by this point, there was only fairly short window to actually, to get some more tests done, find out what the problems were, and then make any decisions that might have to be made. It was real. 15/02/2014 08:02. For once in my life, I had been organised. It would be a personal tragedy for my partner and me, but that is all. 18-20 week scans provide clinicians with more information than earlier scans because by18 weeks a healthy baby should be larger and better developed. How common is it for 2nd baby to come early..? Just doing it. And I can, the words that the scanning member of staff used, "Everything's fine", will stay with me forever. The weeks since that day have been very weird. I felt I needed proof of what was wrong before I take such a huge decision and that I couldn't do it based on what someone had written on, on the paper. I have horrible thoughts. So it was quite common, this is what happens. And I'd been on the internet looking up all sorts of things and everything was so negative, it was very depressing, because I thought, 'Well, maybe they've made a mistake, or maybe it's something they can fix, I don't know'. Can you describe the difference between the scan at this later stage in a pregnancy? An appointment should be arranged as soon as possible and ideally within three working days. You have rejected additional cookies. Later, I did see and hold our baby. Intellectually, I knew this was not the case. And then I can't remember an awful lot more about that scan apart from that feeling of searching of how to react in an unknown situation - your brain's kind of trying to work out what to say, what to do, but I had no idea what to say or what to do and I think my first thought was, does that mean our first daughter's okay? So I sort of went home quite, fairly kind of happy and I, at, at this point I hadn't any idea things could go wrong anyway. The hormone levels had dropped, but they wanted to scan me again. No one else felt him kick. I felt empty, scared, guilty and incredibly heartbroken. He sounded like a wild animal in pain, deep pain. The same unique expression he had when he saw our two year old born. If you are not sure, you can contact them and ask. I just feel very unlucky. I had to be rescanned latter. The week that followed was an agonising wait. It went from bad, to worse, to worse, to dire, then to better. The scan was inconclusive, but the size of my little bump was measuring a lot smaller than it should have for 10 weeks. I think the whole experience has made me a pretty nasty person. The same anxious wait for a little, pathetic cry. I wasn't unduly worried at all. Eventually, the doctor finished the scan and said that some of the baby's measurements were very small. In fact, interestingly enough, going sort of. And how wrong could they be? This scan takes place between 18 weeks and 20 weeks 6 days of pregnancy and is commonly called the 20-week scan. We spent the next few weeks in a happy bubble. The doctor explained the options I had to manage my miscarriage. Some of the other conditions, such as heart defects, are more difficult to see. Emma was 20 weeks' pregnant when a routine scan revealed that the baby she was expecting had Down's syndrome and heart problems. It doesn't remove the guilt, but I don't know what else to do. And at that, I let out a scream I think. At the time the same thing had, exactly the same thing had happened to my friend a month before, and her scan was absolutely fine. For instance a couple who knew their baby was 'on the small size' were told he was fine at the 18-20 week scan, but discovered at 32 weeks that he had microcephaly. I then had to wait in the room along with many other patients for an hour so they could observe me. . No one else but my partner saw how similar he was to our son. I was told that while bad news at the 12 w scan is often of the life or death kind, bad news at the 20 week scan is often of the 'needs an operation in childhood' or 'needs to wear a brace for a year' kind. It was far too much power; neither of us wanted it. I faced another internal scan where I began to feel helpless and alone. Somehow, I walked from the sofa up to the bathroom and told my partner. Is it the same scan or is it the same equipment? Did you, how did that scan make you feel? He felt strong and fit and healthy. Bad news at 20 week scan | Mumsnet 26/09/2019 22:46. The first result, which tells you if the baby has Down's syndrome, is ready in three days, but the other chromosomal problems cannot be eliminated for up to three weeks. I couldn't bring myself to push. It seemed a very arbitrary system, and so you quite often sat outside in the waiting room for a couple of hours before you actually got to see the consultant, which was, seemed you know, I kind of remember thinking before we went in to see him on the particular day when we found out there was a problem, 'Why are we sitting here? Usually, sonographers will ask a senior sonographer colleague to confirm findings and this should be done immediately. Let a mum know you're thinking of them send one of our personalised Mother's Day cards today, Home So we went home really and I sort of had to think about it all night. The hardest thing I have ever done | Health | The Guardian And, sometimes, I wish I had invited my whole family into the hospital room to see him. He bluntly told me, he wasn't interested in whatever was seen before, he was only going to go by what he saw that day. I didn't want to be convincing him to agree with me. On the next shift, the new midwife asked us again. And it's, I can't remember exactly what it was now, it's about where the brain is supposed to form. And I knew there was no way out. I can feel my child kick, it responds when he shouts at football - I mean literally, this baby used to dance around whenever he'd like scream at a goal - and there cannot be anything wrong with this child because it's part of us already. But I was struggling mentally with the anguish, grief and endless hospital visits. But the consultant had found more spots on the heart and the measurements were the same. Saturday came. I then found that soft markers means 'vague unproven suggestion of a link', and that echogenic locii are small concentrations of calcium which are incredibly common and harmless. Maybe our son would have overcome his problems, survived his illnesses, led a happy life. Very occasionally this second scan cannot be completed, for example because: In this case you will not be offered another screening scan but you will offered an all over physical examination for your baby after birth. He started to scan me with a cold expression, then told me, "it didn't look good" and that "my womb looked raggedy". The doctor didn't come. What would we like to do with the body? Picture every packed football staduim up and down the country - all healthy pregnancies and births. See you in -. For instance a couple who knew their baby was 'on the small size' were told he was fine at the 18-20 week scan, but discovered at 32 weeks that he had microcephaly. No one else attended and we didn't have a service. I'd had the scan in the scanning room, I can't remember what they call it now, it's silly, it's gone from my head. The doctor told me he was 98% sure this was a failing twin pregnancy. Our week-by-week PREGNANCY emails are a must for parents-to-be. Two days, after on Christmas Eve, (my 12 week date) I had more blood tests. Could she possibly have something that's not been detected? The 18 -20 week fetal anomaly scan is a watershed in most pregnancies because for the majority of women it will be the last time they are scanned before giving birth. the amniocentesis) and the pregnancy had already ended, or because the scan was not routinely offered in their region 5 or more years ago. And it was just a bit of a shock because it's not really what you want to hear - you don't really expect that. Wishing to be anywhere, but here being told the same agonising truth over and over again. I sat and waited to be called for my scan. Those two weeks were agonising for us both. So we had to go in and out a couple of times, and we were just waiting around for ages and ages. And shortly after that, that scan we'd finished and the consultant leant back and said, 'I'm afraid we have some problems here'. What are the chances of bad news at the 20 week scan | Mumsnet What happens at the second midwife appointment? But on, in the middle of March, 10th March it was, we had a 20 week scan. However painful and traumatic the labour was, it was better than what would happen at the end of it. I couldn't really believe what they were saying. I had to wait yet another sleepless night. I hadn't thought about the mechanics of such a late termination, but had assumed it would mean some kind of operation. Some stories I hear are amazing! She asked me how far gone I thought we were, and if I could have been mistaken. I agreed to an internal scan as the sonographer said we could get a better picture of what was happening. The consultant explained that this was just very bad luck and not, as far as they knew, genetic. (See. That he was small. Went off for the 20-week scan, which you didn't, you weren't there, were you, for the first scan? No, you couldn't see there was anything wrong. But you could see there was something wrong? This image shows a baby's face and hands at 20 weeks, and gives you an idea of what you'll be able to see at this scan. Back on the EPU unit, a doctor organised for me to be admitted into the ward, to take the medical management under supervision as the sac was now to big for me to safely miscarry on my own at home. It was, 'Oh we'll come back to that'. Likely to have serious medical problems all his life. Many people were deeply affected by their experiences of the 20-week and subsequent specialist scans. Can you remember that minute. I tried to show him the notes and the photos. Any delay in receiving more information about the abnormality and its implications will be distressing for women and this should be acknowledged. You have accepted additional cookies. There was an extra digit on one of the hands. News stories, speeches, letters and notices, Reports, analysis and official statistics, Data, Freedom of Information releases and corporate reports. By my own hand, I had to end the pregnancy. The blood test confirmed it was twins. This article was amended on 24 November 2015 to anonymise the writer. Soon, the doctor came and inserted the tablets that would induce labour. But at the 20 week scan, which was on a Wednesday, we saw the nurse at the local hospital, the sonographer, and she did a scan and she found that the femur length was quite short in the, in the fetus. . So I suppose from that aspect, mind you having not been told that or sitting there, I wouldn't have thought necessarily that was odd. And I, my husband and I both ran our own business at the time so we were desperate to get back and do some work, and things were going really well, so.. This does not mean there is anything to worry about. Baby loss stories Sam reassured me, but the guilt had hit me along with the feeling that our world was falling apart. Having the scan does not hurt but the sonographer may need to apply slight pressure to get the best views of your baby. Because, when you're angry with the world for dealing you such a shit time, you begin to hate the people who populate it. He started to scan me with a cold expression, then told me, "it didn't look good" and that "my womb looked raggedy". I took my vitamins, stuck to the healthy diet and put on a brave face. And so we talked about it euphemistically, never saying the word "research". There were also two spots on his heart, which were "soft markers" for Down's syndrome. And at that point I don't think we, I don't think we realised that there might have to be a decision, because we'd talked about it with, with Down's and the other possible problems, but at this point it was, well okay what can be done to fix the problem - because yes the heart's not developing properly but there must be something we can do. He looked fine. Never being able to look after himself. Some people had underestimated how serious any abnormality found at this stage could be for the baby. For many other women, the 18-20 week scan was the point at which they discovered the baby had serious problems. If you think you may have a medical emergency, call your doctor, midwife or hospital immediately. Specialist scans So that just left the talipes. As I waited for the doctor back on the EPU unit. I have a terrible hatred of pregnant women and a new respect for infertile couples. He felt doing more blood tests would only cause me more discomfort and false hope. I had to wait for a doctor to explain the situation. The nursery I had selected for our two-year-old son; my maternity leave; the bunk beds; the summer holiday suitable for a newborn baby. We were told to go to the hospital immediately. She didn't say at the time that it was a major problem or that it was something to watch out for. I was willing the results to be normal. I had no issues at my 20wk scan with DD - and neither did any of my antenatal group (9 mums). Some people we talked to had not had a 18-20-week scan, either because their babies' abnormalities had been detected by earlier . To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account. Do you have any thoughts about that? He started to scan me with a cold expression, then told me - Tommy's We're going to go and see them. We had the 20 week scan yesterday and got some devastating news. And they took us out of the scanning room, into a more quiet room while they typed up the report. 18-20 week scans provide clinicians with more information than earlier scans because by18 weeks a healthy baby should be larger and better developed. There was cause for concern. . And I said, I was still laughing, and I thought he was joking with me, and he said now I sort of could tell from his face that by that point he wasn't really joking anymore. When I told him what had happened, he refused to believe anything was wrong and said he'd sort it out when he came home. I don't know how we got through the next couple of days. Despite this new discovery, the sonographer was still concerned. There is always a chance that a baby may be born with a health issue that scans could not have identified. We need to have your opinion'. And with each one we had to have the same conversations. So I took the test and jumped in the shower. But even if I was there, I still think I would have wanted to see the detail on the scan. Just wonder whether anyone had ever been told? I wrote a few things down last night when we were trying to go over things, just to remind myself. We went in, had a scan, I can't remember the exact sequence of events because the baby was still in the wrong position. And I felt like a murderer. I can't remember the exact words but she said, 'There might be some fatal problems with your baby'. Eventually, the midwife said to us very sweetly, "I think we should deliver the baby now." And my husband, we never got to sit next to each other in the consulting room, my husband was across the room from me, and I was sat next to the consultant, and we were laughing and joking with him about, you know, the home delivery, and everything was going to be, 'Are you still on for the home delivery?' To view this licence, visit nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3 or write to the Information Policy Team, The National Archives, Kew, London TW9 4DU, or email: psi@nationalarchives.gov.uk. 11 physical conditions (20-week scan) - GOV.UK So we decided to book an early 10 week private scan. I felt more informed, and I felt that that was what I needed in my head to see you know, that I've got to accept now that this, all these things are real on the screen and this was really my baby that's suffering all these things [sighs], but I was sad as well. So he went out for a walk. Our nightmare began when I went for my 20-week scan. I had to stop myself from yanking out the needle. Again, no notes can have been written down because the midwife asked the same question. If this happens, you will be offered one further scan by 23 weeks of pregnancy. The midwife was on the verge of tears and I felt responsible. The doctor gave her consent, and I took the four little tablets. Some people had underestimated how serious any abnormality found at this stage could be for the baby. The people who did know what was going on seemed far too sure that we were doing the right thing, that there was really no choice to be made. It would have been nice to see someone straight away because I was in such shock.

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