kerdi membrane over cement boardmark james actor love boat

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What are the differences between "paperless drywall" and "cement board"? Kerdi membrane prevents water damage and mold development. This will include installing its components, such as drain plate and drain collar, as well as Kerdi Band for further protection of seams and corners. KERDI was developed as a waterproofing membrane to be used in . No bulges either, but definetly no thin spots.-Not paying attention to the direction of the comb. In general, the Schlter system is typically more expensive than a cement board, and some people may find this an attractive option for its long lasting, easy to maintain qualities. I think I'll try using the thinned mixture of Redgard and then try the Kerdi membrane again. Kerdi-Shower-T/-TS/-TT is a prefabricated sloped shower tray with integrated Kerdi waterproofing. Cement board comes both in 1/4-inch-thick and 1/2-inch-thick versions. Additionally, all thin-set should be allowed to cure for 24 hours before tiles are installed. Since my guys and I will be doing this for the first time next week, I 'd like to take advantage of your 'learning curve.' Drywall under Kerdi would have been a better choice. Your Get free, zero-commitment quotes from pro contractors near you. Cement board (cbu) is not waterproof, but is not damaged by being wet. This means that even if your waterproofing system leaks, the cement board will remain intact. On top of that, fiber cement board is even more brittle than standard cement board, so you have to be extra careful to keep screws at least an inch from the edge to avoid breaking the board. Given the complexity, its easy to see why even experienced tile setters avoid dry-pack mortar and use backer board instead when they can. Such membranes typically come in a brush or a roller form and can help create a durable barrier against water infiltration. And for a more secure fit, you can also use screws. (3ft-3in wide). It fell right off? Our thinset was more watery than the videos, but it still managed to dry out quickly, even in the time it takes to apply the small corners in our shampoo niche. Step 4: Place the Tile. Just wondering how effective is the tile on kerdi membrane vs the traditional cement backboard where tiles are glued directly to the drywall? See the foam bench and the corners. . My floor tiles are 2" x 2"." - Lisa Jasper No - you can not use Kerdi Board on the floor. Additionally, the drywall should be primed with a latex primer before applying the Kerdi membrane. Spacers are the next step. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. First, you would waterproof with your favorite liquid waterproofing membrane of . The type of bonding mortar used to apply KERDI must be suitable for the substrate and must penetrate and engage the membrane fleece. We installed cement board on the walls, and today when we attempted to apply the Kerdi membrane we could not get it to adhere. Step 3: Apply Thinset. Will be doing a bathroom gut and will be laying durock cement board over plywood sub floor. Are there tables of wastage rates for different fruit and veg? Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? Now there's nothing particularly wrong with fiber-cementit's just not my first choice. Install an Uncoupling Membrane Between Concrete and Tile. On the other hand, a Schlter system offers improved thermal insulation, which can help to reduce heating costs. I've never had a failure. Foam-core tile backing board has two big advantages over other backer boards. A lot of folks like using cement board but it's heavy and requires a waterproofing membrane over it. Recovering from a blunder I made while emailing a professor, Minimising the environmental effects of my dyson brain. I think the first one I used was cheap and that was part of the problem. Most of the entries in the NAME column of the output from lsof +D /tmp do not begin with /tmp. To line niche shelves, for instance. One of the major benefits of opting for Kerdi Board over cement board is the ease of installation. Hardi is definitely a "thirsty" substrate but will work, even without a primer of RedGard. In normal residential use I wouldn't worry about it. x 96 in. I agree that gypsum seems very questionable anywhere in the wet areas of a shower. She grew up surrounded by constant home improvement projects and owes most of what she knows to helping her dad renovate her childhood home. In the worst case, it's OK to cut the Kerdi, remove the damaged section, scrape up the thinset from the areas, and set a new piece of Kerdi. Following the instructions for the product being used and ensuring that all of the necessary steps are followed will help to ensure a successful installation. Seems like I've been using the full measure of water the bag calls for, plus about 10%.-50 lbs of thinset at a time is too much for an amatuer. Sweeby-Can you clarify- I undestood that the thinset would tend to dry out from the thirsty hardi or skim over from the air; so how does booking the Kerdi help with the first? How to follow the signal when reading the schematic? What can a lawyer do if the client wants him to be acquitted of everything despite serious evidence? This allows the cement to properly hydrate, resulting in a strong, dense bond coat. Ditra is a 1/8-inch thick polyethylene membrane with a layer of anchoring fleece on the underside and a grid of square cavities on top. Because it can let some moisture wick through it, you have two choices: put a moisture barrier behind it to protect the structure, or, waterproof the front of it. However, you do still have to take care to waterproof the seams and the fastener penetrations to create a waterproof assembly. Do I have to use Kerdi tape with Ditra membrane? builder, anti-builder, rebuilder -- Retired Moderator. "thanks in advance :-) I know so little about this stuff, but when I watch videos (made by schluter-kerdi) everything looks so tidy and perfect - maybe that's not realistic'''" - Lisa Jasper It should look better than that and it's hard to tell but the wall stud spacing looks extreme and more than 16" I could not see if the screw heads where covered in the photos and in the one picture you can see that the screw and washer fitting where not covered. First, felt paper is stapled to the floor and covered with expanded metal lath. Step 2: Determine the room's center. ps, now that you don't need it anymore you can throw that useless cheap piece of crap magnesium float my way. I hope you made the guy flood test his work prior to tiling the shower floor. When applying Kerdi membrane to cement board, the edges and seams of the membrane must be lapped, meaning that each layer should overlap the portion underneath it by a minimum of two inches. Cement board is a mineral-based board, usually 30 inches by 60 inches, that is used as a lower, dimensionally stable surface for installing ceramic tile, porcelain tile, or stonework. Or will the Kerdi membrane (with seams taped with kerdi band) prevent each board from moving independently? Even the tiling subs have moved away from mortar walls because of the labor cost and lack of craftsmen in the industry. This is confusing since Kerdi Board has no Kerdi on it. The most important thing to remember when applying the membrane over the cement board is to make sure the surface is clean and free of any debris, dust or other contaminants. Then cement, sand and water are mixed together to a crumbly consistency and floated over the lath to form a flat surface. Installation; As the GoBoard is very lightweight, it becomes easy to . If there is no blocking behind the seam, i would just tape prior to installing the membrane, the thinset will fill the seam and embed the mesh. The cement board needs to be clean, free of debris, and dry. Yes, you should prime drywall before installing KERDI in order to ensure proper adhesion and a successful installation. Additionally, you can use KERDI-BAND around corners, seams, and joints to help with a waterproof installation. By the time you switch from the RG application to the Kerdi installation, it should be dry. I used 1/2 Hardibacker board over the studs and then used the Kerdi membrane over the Hardi. Any recommendations? @DMoore- OK, I agree that with redguard it would be redundant. Moisture resistant can cause similar problems, and there is absolutely no advantage to it. I would get someone else. Fiber cement board is available in 1/4-inch and 1/2-inch thicknesses. Schluter-KERDI is a pliable, sheet-applied, bonded waterproof membrane and vapor retarder with limited crack-bridging capabilities. That was not a fault of the Kerdi, or the installation. Why are physically impossible and logically impossible concepts considered separate in terms of probability? Kerdi Board as a whole is much easier to install than Cement Board. I guess that why it was so frustrating that cement board is just sooo thirsty. All shower/tub areas should have concrete board (I prefer hardiboard). It's not a matter of trusting the Kerdi. When applying the primer, make sure to cover all surfaces thoroughly, as these will be completely covered by the KERDI membrane. Plus, most self-leveling formulas harden very fast, so you have to plan carefully so you can mix and pour quickly. They can be installed on any type of support and can even be used to create partitions, with no structural support required. You'll know the RG is dry when it turns reallllly dark bright red as opposed to the pinkish color when applied. Additionally, if the cement board isnt waterproof, it can also cause mold and mildew issues, as well as dry wall damage from the moisture seeping through. Cement board is a heavy mess compared to drywall, and drywall is a heavy mess compared to Kerdi Board. Once all that is completed and the Aquadefense has dried, you can install your tile with a polymer modified mortar meeting the ANSI requirements of A118.4 or A118.11. Do the prefab Schluter niches like the double unit 12 by 28shelf have a built in pitch to the bottom and middle shelves to drainoff water as shown in niche that you built in that thread? We want that inside corner able to move. If you want added info there's an old Kerdi thread here. This liquid waterproofing solution does more than keep water away, it also promotes tile adhesion and prevents cracking. How long should I wait after painting on the Redgard before I try to reapply the membrane? But there are downsides. Cut the Kerdi membrane to size using a utility knife or scissors. A mortar wall is better and can be customized easier. Is a PhD visitor considered as a visiting scholar? After installing your mud bed, make sure it is fully cured before applying Aquadefense. It is easier to cut than cement board, it is mold resistant, and it has a built-in moisture barrier. Answer (1 of 3): Schluter recommends applying Kerdi over drywall for walls, however, my local building code will not permit this practice - the local building code requires cement backer on the walls of a shower enclosure, therefore, I have done this successfully many times. FRC board tends to be more moisture-resistant than gypsum board and is best suited for outdoor projects such as showers or tub surrounds. If you are good with a trowel and understand how to set up and use screeds as a guide for leveling or forming the mortar, pouring a traditional mortar bed may be a good alternative to tile backer board, especially on uneven or sloping floors. It is designed to form a waterproof layer between cement board and tiles, helping create a watertight installation. When cleaning thinset off of Schluter membranes, the manufacturer recommends using a wet sponge and taking care to avoid any scoring or inconsistencies on the surface of the membrane. If you are looking for a way to minimize height buildup and eliminate a large level difference at thresholds, a mat product is a good solution. The boards come in three-foot by five-foot and four-foot by eight-foot panels, sized for efficient use in bathrooms. Je peux rejeter les cookies non essentiels en cliquant sur Grer mes prfrences . Kerdi Membrane is a product of Schluter systems. Look at it this way; Withe Kerdi, you either trust it or you don't. Please feel free to reach out to our Product Support Team at 1-800-992-6273 if you need anything. I will say that to is easier to put the membrane over drywall than cement board. This will ensure a strong bond between the KERDI membrane and the substrate. This makes Kerdi Board suitable for a wide variety of interior applications, including kitchen countertops. How should I transition between cement board floor and alcove tub? So long as the seams and joint areas are properly prepared, the panels can also provide waterproofing. What do you mean it doesn't adhere? is the contractor creating a waterproof schluter-kerdi shower? Not even the plumber's fault as it was just a bad valve. :/. As fiber cement board is similar to regular cement board, it makes sense to choose the one that is cheaper or more readily available. Installing cement board involves placing the boards atop a layer of thinset adhesive, a process known as bedding. The thickness of the tile is important, and should be known, but not because it changes the method of building. What to use to flatten and prep wall before installing Schluter Kerdi membrane for tiling? As such, many homeowners and professionals find themselves wondering whether Kerdi Board or cement board is the better tile substrate. A hundred times better to have too much before you comb than too little. Though, each product comes with its own individual characteristics, and pros and cons. All it takes is the right preparation. If you choose to use Aquadefense as a shower pan liner, be sure to continue it up the walls at least 6", tying into your waterproofing on the walls. The 1/4-inch-thick board is typically used on floors and countertops. Kerdi-Board is an extruded polystyrene foam panel, with reinforcing material on both sides, covered by fleece webbing for effective anchoring of thin-set mortar. What is a word for the arcane equivalent of a monastery? Why is this the case? Cut the shower tray to size. More waste, yes, but I think you have to have a LOT of practice to hang those huge sheets like mongo does. However, a cement board is generally easier and less expensive to replace if a repair is needed. Cementboard sufficient to a tub surround is dirt cheap .vs. Kerdi is also used as shower lining, as required in IRC Section P2709.2 and IPC Section 417.5.2, over concrete, mortar, tile backerboard, expanded polystyrene foam board, prefabricated polystyrene shower trays, curb and ramp, gypsum board and masonry substrates." So, you can choose what board you want in your shower when using Kerdi. Any competent tile contractor would float the wall in mortar giving you a stronger, level, perfectly flat, and square surface to properly install tile. The taping knife at a low angle makes an enormous difference, and I'm very grateful for that hint. The tub flange can really be a pain in the butt when installing a tile tub surround. I trust it and have never had a callback. The problem is on the back side of the drywall, which is not protected. The cement board core itself is not waterproof, but it can withstand water without falling apart. Finally, make sure to select a thinset that is appropriate for the job, check the manufacturers recommendation, and always follow the instructions on the product label. Needed to interject a little "amateur humor. This will help you achieve the best results and ensure the longevity of your project. It doesn't matter but you absolutely need to use both a substrate and a waterproofing membrane. About an argument in Famine, Affluence and Morality, Acidity of alcohols and basicity of amines. The site is called floorelf.com. It costs more but it;s worth it for the ease of install IMO. When it comes to applying KERDI, however, it is advised to use a regular thinset that includes portland cement as its main component. Contact us: 888-472-4588 The Schlter system tends to be more durable than a cement board, but it also depends on the particular application and the weather. On the 'rolling pin', it actually wasn't the kitchen kind, but rather a very heavy metal roller DH had from some sort of fabrication table. It is important to overlap the edge of the membrane so that it covers slightly more than half of the drywall behind it. There are numerous ways to do this. The drywall's back side fails, and it's just as bad or worse than it was on the tile side. Kerdi's systems are fairly reputable. Yes, Hardie board needs to be waterproofed. After priming, use an approved adhesive to adhere the KERDI membrane to the drywall, making sure the edges are well sealed and joints are tight.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4','ezslot_12',156,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4-0'); A successful installation of KERDI requires well-prepared surfaces and a proper application, so take the time to properly prime the drywall before installation. The fastest method [for me and possibly other dilettants] is to stroke the knife at a diagonal to the comb marks, top down, center out, pushing all the air before you with short, overlapping strokes.-Thinset needs to be pretty darn wet: Needs to stay put when combed, but should be soft and shiney. We don't expect people to master this and in fact I know maybe two guys in my area (live in big city) that could do this. Learn about the options in exterior siding before you choose, Before you pick up a single tile, pull from these tips for expert results, Slip resistance, curves and even the mineral content of your water all affect which tile is best for your shower, We help a Houzz user ask all the right questions for designing a stylish, practical and safe shower bench, This isn't a light DIY project: You'll need heavy-duty tools and plenty of protection for your home and yourself, In steamy quarters, tile needs to stand up to all that water and vapor in style. Its important to note that Kerdi membrane is not a structural base layer, so plywood should be installed and reinforced as necessary based on load requirements. What? Also - use a good thinset. We tried soaking the cement board and applying the kerdi in small sections. If any is found, wait a few more hours and then re-inspect. However if installed on drywall it is only protecting one side. The back side of the drywall fails and it is just as bad or worse than if it had an issue on the tile side. What was the indicator that let you know that spritzing was not enough, and that you needed to 'sponge' the Hardi? If done according to manufacturers instructions, it will seal nicely. Once the wall is prepped, use a primer that is compatible with the KERDI membrane so that it will properly adhere to the wall. When screwed to the framing, thin strips of cement board fracture more easily than thin strips of fiber-cement. One thing I do like fibercement (Hardie) for is when I need thin strips of cement board. The type of bonding mortar used to apply KERDI must be suitable for the substrate and must penetrate and engage the membrane fleece. As a contractor, I have been using Kerdi since it came out. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1','ezslot_27',168,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1-0');if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1','ezslot_28',168,'0','1'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-narrow-sky-1-0_1');.narrow-sky-1-multi-168{border:none!important;display:block!important;float:none!important;line-height:0;margin-bottom:15px!important;margin-left:auto!important;margin-right:auto!important;margin-top:15px!important;max-width:100%!important;min-height:250px;min-width:250px;padding:0;text-align:center!important}Waterproofing should also be done on other areas in the shower as well such as the corners, window sills and other areas where water can easily accumulate. This will help to ensure that all drywall is completely covered. Anytime Mongo. Retired Moderator - Theatre Guy (and computers). The shower is ready for tile. When I do another shower I'll use real cement board, not Hardi-board. Kerdi can even be installed over drywall. The mortar does . In a perfect job, it will waterproof. That would tell him where the edge of the framing needs to be. Seams and joints should also be waterproofed and caulked to prevent water from seeping through. If I go the kerdi membrane route, do I still need to tape the joints before installing the kerdi membrane . Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. A good rule of thumb is 24 hours per inch of thickness, then one more day on top of that to be sure. There is a product called Kerdiboard you might want to look into. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. A square foot of half-inch thick cement board weighs roughly 40 ounces, while the equivalent area of a Wedi board weighs about 75% less. Thinset with a latex acrylic modifier is best for interior projects, but if youre installing outdoors, you should use thinset with a polymer modified (PM) compound for greater moisture resistance. Underlayment is designed to smooth out uneven areas of the subfloor and form a rigid layer that prevents the flooring from bending. We tried adding water to the thinset, we tried . You peeled it off? Installation instructions vary depending on the type of Kerdi membrane being used, but typically the membrane is applied directly to a clean, dry plywood surface that is free from dust, dirt, and other debris. If you preorder a special airline meal (e.g. I used to "trust" the Kerdi and drywall until I had a shower that the valve broke inside the wall cavity four years after being put in. There is definitely skill & planning required to doit right. Greenboard is the same as regular drywall. If you want to go to the extra effort of putting the membrane over drywall, there is no need to use greenboard. Kerdi Board vs. Cement Board. While cement board and grout are not waterproof, Kerdi is and can even be directly installed over drywall. It looks like you have Kerdi installed on the floor and not Kerdi Board. It is lightweight and made of expanded polystyrene. I used 1/2 Hardibacker board over the studs and then used the Kerdi membrane over the Hardi. Keep in mind that most tile setters err on the side of caution and brush a waterproofing membrane on top of cement board when it is in wet areas like showers or tub surrounds. link to How To Organize A Bathroom Closet. Probably the simplest way is to caulk the gap with 100% silicone or a urethane sealant. Whether youre installing tile on a floor, wall, or countertop, choosing the right type of substrate, or underlayment, is critical to preventing breaks and cracks in both the tile and the grout. When it comes to using thinset with Schluter products, the Schluter-Systems website recommends using unmodified thin-set mortars specifically designed for use with Schluter membranes. Make sure to use multiple coats, if necessary. It worked well - just like wallpapering. If installing large format tiles (over 15"), be sure to give the Aquadefense at least 8 hours to cure first. When screwed to the framing, thin strips of cement board fracture more easily than thin strips of fiber-cement. You just need a hammer and wonderbar for the walls. Waterproofing cement board is relatively simple and there are several different waterproofing products available. This will ensure that the coating sticks to the cement board. To properly seal a cement board for a shower, its important to first properly prepare the surface. After roughly two days I would fill the corner with silicone. Once its cleaned, use caulk to seal all of the seams where the cement board meets the walls. Depending on your project and the specific cement board you are using, you will want to select a thinset appropriate for both.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-large-leaderboard-2','ezslot_15',158,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-large-leaderboard-2-0'); The two primary criteria to help guide your selection are the type of cement board you are using and whether you are installing it indoors or outdoors. Cement board is the industry standard when it comes to tile substrates and the most preferred among professionals when installing porcelain or ceramic tile. Wedi showers feature a pre-sloped base that is already installed. The Kerdi is essentially replacing the backerboard. rev2023.3.3.43278. When installed, Kerdi Board creates a substrate that is level, flat, square, plumb, and dimensionally stable. Anyone who has done more than 1 shower shouldn't start without knowing that. I would fear leaks in all corners of this shower. Will use the Schluter Shower system. This is a bit difficult to answer as it depends on the particular application for the floor system. Slap it up comb it out, leave every ridge tall and perfect. But that doesn't address your question, so it's just a comment, not an answer as such. Its essential to protect surrounding wall and floor surfaces from water or moisture damage that can occur in these areas. The product involves an extruded polystyrene foam panel, with specialized reinforcement materials on both sides. With that said, the key benefits of Kerdi Board include: While cement board may be the most common and widely-known tile substrate, Kerdi Board is giving it a run for its money.

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